climateprediction.net home page
Little work, yet the most "important" thing in the world?

Little work, yet the most "important" thing in the world?

Message boards : Number crunching : Little work, yet the most "important" thing in the world?
Message board moderation

To post messages, you must log in.

Previous · 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5

AuthorMessage
Les Bayliss
Volunteer moderator

Send message
Joined: 5 Sep 04
Posts: 7501
Credit: 23,647,569
RAC: 2,773
Message 63882 - Posted: 17 Apr 2021, 22:11:59 UTC - in response to Message 63880.  

As has been posted many times here over the years, the climate model codes belong to the UK Met Office.

The researchers from various places around the world just use what is available.
And they can, and probably do, talk to the Oxford project people about it.

Also, VMs are for the cruchers to create and use.
ID: 63882 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Peter Hucker

Send message
Joined: 9 Oct 20
Posts: 156
Credit: 1,761,668
RAC: 0
Message 63893 - Posted: 19 Apr 2021, 17:56:20 UTC - in response to Message 63881.  

Peter

Saying that the researchers are too stupid to know how long the models are taking to get processed is just trolling.
Future posts along these lines will be deleted.
I didn't call them stupid, why are you putting words into my mouth? I said if they insist on using Linux, they will have a long wait. Now please try to interpret English better in the future eh?
ID: 63893 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Les Bayliss
Volunteer moderator

Send message
Joined: 5 Sep 04
Posts: 7501
Credit: 23,647,569
RAC: 2,773
Message 63894 - Posted: 19 Apr 2021, 21:22:48 UTC - in response to Message 63893.  

The researchers are perfectly aware of how long it will take.
They're just not interested in using Windows.
ID: 63894 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Alan K

Send message
Joined: 22 Feb 06
Posts: 404
Credit: 18,094,993
RAC: 3,067
Message 63896 - Posted: 19 Apr 2021, 22:16:25 UTC - in response to Message 63894.  

The researchers are perfectly aware of how long it will take.
They're just not interested in using Windows.


As an idle thought but is it because there are free compilers for Linux but not for Windows?
ID: 63896 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Les Bayliss
Volunteer moderator

Send message
Joined: 5 Sep 04
Posts: 7501
Credit: 23,647,569
RAC: 2,773
Message 63897 - Posted: 20 Apr 2021, 0:03:20 UTC - in response to Message 63896.  

It's mostly because they use Unix on main frame computers.
ID: 63897 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
klepel

Send message
Joined: 9 Oct 04
Posts: 60
Credit: 54,879,856
RAC: 19,977
Message 63924 - Posted: 30 Apr 2021, 0:17:10 UTC
Last modified: 30 Apr 2021, 0:18:26 UTC

For those with Win10 computers, I successfully installed WSL2 with Ubuntu on one of my Win10 computers:https://www.cpdn.org/results.php?hostid=1517859
After receiving the first Tickle everything looks very promising!
I sincerely hope that some of the Win10 user community, who run their computer 24/7 might try as well, so the CPDN Linux WUs will get processed a little bit faster.
I do not consider me a computer specialist; my knowledge is fairly limited with Windows as well as Linux.
ID: 63924 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
KAMasud

Send message
Joined: 6 Oct 06
Posts: 151
Credit: 5,974,056
RAC: 6,916
Message 63937 - Posted: 5 May 2021, 9:23:09 UTC

Hardest part on installing CPDN under Linux was finding out, which packets are needed. Maybe some should write this on the starts page, right to the explanation how to install and run CPDN with Boinc.

Edit:
Found the following thread, maybe this could be linked on: https://www.cpdn.org/forum_thread.php?id=8916&postid=62038

Greets
Felix
__________________________________

The packets needed are given on the Linux Boinc download page.
Boinc Wiki https://boinc.berkeley.edu/wiki/Installing_on_Linux
Just Google up "BOINC Linux install" there are several places on the Boinc site itself. For all the other projects also.
_________________________________
Talk about "Ants in the pants thingy"
Peter, won't it be more fun to defenestrate a person? Please say yes. Anyway, things were very busy in Prague when this word was coined.
ID: 63937 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Peter Hucker

Send message
Joined: 9 Oct 20
Posts: 156
Credit: 1,761,668
RAC: 0
Message 63941 - Posted: 5 May 2021, 17:06:32 UTC - in response to Message 63937.  

Hardest part on installing CPDN under Linux was finding out, which packets are needed. Maybe some should write this on the starts page, right to the explanation how to install and run CPDN with Boinc.
Can it not be automated? I've never had to do anything other than "attach to project" on any of the projects I've ever run in Windows. Is it Linux that causes the difficulty, or CPDN? CPDN just works with Windows. No libraries to add etc.

Talk about "Ants in the pants thingy"
Peter, won't it be more fun to defenestrate a person? Please say yes. Anyway, things were very busy in Prague when this word was coined.
Yes it is more fun. My friend did it to his little brother when we were teenagers. From the 2nd story. Somehow no bones got broken. I've never tried it myself, although I have hospitalised someone.
ID: 63941 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Dave Jackson
Volunteer moderator

Send message
Joined: 15 May 09
Posts: 3172
Credit: 8,768,135
RAC: 9,769
Message 63943 - Posted: 5 May 2021, 19:24:43 UTC

The 32bit libraries is not a problem unique to CPDN. It is an issue for a number of projects under Linux. With CPDN the issue is with something like a million lines of Fortran which has been compiled sorting out a 64bit version of programs from the met office without the source code or a license that allows mucking about with it even if we had the source is a far from trivial task even if the project had programmers with the necessary Fortran knowledge.

Sorting it out for other projects some of which may have written their own code would I assume be easier, even if they haven't seen the need to do it yet.

At some point there will probably be OpenIFS tasks for Linux and Mac which are 64bit and should, "just work." The ones which crashed during testing were problems with ancillary files as I understand it. That and file size limits being set too low in some cases. Then of course there is just the sheer complexity of climate modelling that means mistakes are more likely. Most get caught by the testing branch but not all.
ID: 63943 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Eirik Redd

Send message
Joined: 31 Aug 04
Posts: 381
Credit: 176,505,788
RAC: 97,307
Message 63949 - Posted: 7 May 2021, 5:32:19 UTC - in response to Message 63897.  

It's mostly because they use Unix on main frame computers.

Or on what they now call "supercomputers"
ID: 63949 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Eirik Redd

Send message
Joined: 31 Aug 04
Posts: 381
Credit: 176,505,788
RAC: 97,307
Message 63950 - Posted: 7 May 2021, 5:58:06 UTC - in response to Message 63943.  

The 32bit libraries is not a problem unique to CPDN. It is an issue for a number of projects under Linux. With CPDN the issue is with something like a million lines of Fortran which has been compiled sorting out a 64bit version of programs from the met office without the source code or a license that allows mucking about with it even if we had the source is a far from trivial task even if the project had programmers with the necessary Fortran knowledge.

Sorting it out for other projects some of which may have written their own code would I assume be easier, even if they haven't seen the need to do it yet.

At some point there will probably be OpenIFS tasks for Linux and Mac which are 64bit and should, "just work." The ones which crashed during testing were problems with ancillary files as I understand it. That and file size limits being set too low in some cases. Then of course there is just the sheer complexity of climate modelling that means mistakes are more likely. Most get caught by the testing branch but not all.


I've learned a quick method, which not everyone will like, that has helped with me 2-3 recent linux installs, that gets all the 32-bit libs needed in a few seconds or minutes or even hours, depending on your internet download speed

No finding the executables, no ldd-ing to find the libraries, no looking up past threads here.
It's now part of my install procedure for linux users who want to do CPDN. But requires a bit of trust in winehq.org developers I don't know well.

Just go to winehq.org and follow the instructions for downloading to your flavor of linux. There's an "dpkg --add-architecture i386" (for debian and ubuntu) a "download key && add key " and the the apt-install " .

What reminded me that I've used this successfully for a few installs recently was the recent post here about wsl on Windows. Winehq is kind of an inverse to that (not precisely) .

Anyhow, works for me, uses some disk, but I (almost never use wine anymore) have lostsa old slow disks

HTH -- hope this workaround helps.

er
ID: 63950 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Dave Jackson
Volunteer moderator

Send message
Joined: 15 May 09
Posts: 3172
Credit: 8,768,135
RAC: 9,769
Message 63952 - Posted: 7 May 2021, 10:41:43 UTC - in response to Message 63950.  

HTH -- hope this workaround helps.

Thansk, may get a chance to try that at some point. I haven't used WINE since there was a surfeit of Linux tasks. When as was often the case in the past there was Windows work and nothing for Linux I used it a lot!
ID: 63952 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Previous · 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5

Message boards : Number crunching : Little work, yet the most "important" thing in the world?

©2021 climateprediction.net