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Profile Alan K

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Message 65719 - Posted: 31 Jul 2022, 22:55:36 UTC - in response to Message 65711.  

From memory when I installed BOINC on Ubuntu 20.xx I used from the terminal screen

sudo apt-get install boinc-client boinc-manager

rather than the package install. No apparent problems.


Just to clarify that installed 7.16.6. I couldn't get the package manager to work which is why I did it this way.
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KAMasud

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Message 65720 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 3:31:46 UTC - in response to Message 65718.  

Actually, it's the responsibility of the software packager (in this case, the Linux repository maintainers) to take an appropriate snapshot of the BOINC source code, and package it in a way that suits their distribution and its management tools. That's the way the Linux world works.


Welcome, Richard to the conversation.
I am still not willing to commit a wholesale massacre of WU's in order to change versions. Also, I am new to the World of Linux. Somebody, whoever it is should keep the updated version of Boinc.

https://boinc.berkeley.edu/wiki/Installing_BOINC
Debian
Open a terminal and enter the following command:

sudo apt-get install boinc-client boinc-manager

Ubuntu
Instructions are here.

Instructions for Ubuntu are the same as for Debian.

Help us out who do not know anything about Linux. Please. While in the meantime I will babysit these WU"s.
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Profile Dave Jackson
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Message 65721 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 5:37:09 UTC

I am still not willing to commit a wholesale massacre of WU's in order to change versions. Also, I am new to the World of Linux. Somebody, whoever it is should keep the updated version of Boinc.


I don't think I have ever had tasks crash as a result of changing versions, as far as I can tell they are no more likely to crash after a BOINC version change than any other instance of stopping and restarting the client.
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Les Bayliss
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Message 65722 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 6:10:19 UTC - in response to Message 65720.  

DON'T change anything.
We're just trying to figure out what is going wrong.

Another possibility, is that you're running Linux in a VM on a Windows machine.

I've found it best not to make life too complicated for a computer running climate models.

*********************

The beauty about Linux, is that you can create your own code.
Which is why all of the Linux OS's are different. Their writers had different goals.

I use Linux Mint, which has a desktop similar to Windows, which made the switch between them easier when I changed hundreds of years ago.
(Well, it seems that long. :) )
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AndreyOR

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Message 65723 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 6:34:20 UTC
Last modified: 1 Aug 2022, 6:41:53 UTC

Just to clarify, almost everyone here probably installed BOINC using a package manager. You may have used a GUI version or a command line version in the terminal window. Installing with commands such as
sudo apt-get install boinc-client boinc-manager
or
sudo yum install boinc-client boinc-manager
is installing using package managers such as APT and YUM. The other way to install would be to build it from source code which requires some additional Linux knowledge and specific reasons for installing BOINC or other programs this way. Instructions on the BOINC site are correct, even if they may have been posted a while back, since it's unlikely for command line scripts to change often for a given Linux distribution.

Richard's and Dave's comments are correct, each Linux distro is responsible for maintaining its own package repository and each work with their own priorities as to which packages (i.e. BOINC) get updated and when. BOINC just provides the source code.

KAMasud: I don't think you need to worry about updating anything. As a matter of fact, 7.16.6 is the most common BOINC version used on CPDN. See https://www.cpdn.org/host_stats.php?boinc_version=1. CPDN tasks are usually finicky when disturbed in any way (suspends, shutdowns, restarts). One of the issues you may be having is that your PCs seem to be low on RAM, ~4GB, which maybe insufficient depending on how many tasks you're running simultaneously. Also not enough disk space, as some of your tasks errored out due to low disk space.

Conan: I'm not familiar with Fedora but in Ubuntu I don't remember having any permission issues so it could be a Fedora thing. Also, it's normal, when installing BOINC or other programs, to have different parts be put in different directories. On its site BOINC even tells you which parts go where (and sometimes why). I'm curious how did you install BOINC, you have an unusual version, 17.7.0?
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Profile Conan
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Message 65724 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 6:56:09 UTC - in response to Message 65723.  

G'Day AndreyOR,

Don't know about unusual version as I got from the BOINC Web site, it is classed as a "Pre-Release" Linux version.

The previous Linux official version on the BOINC wed site was 7.4.25 which is running on my other Linux computer and may need an update one day maybe (it prioritizes work a bit better than the new one I reckon).

Conan
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Profile Conan
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Message 65726 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 7:02:03 UTC

All batches are being processed, are there any new work developments on the horizon?

Thanks
Conan
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Les Bayliss
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Message 65727 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 7:38:58 UTC - in response to Message 65726.  

No. :(
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Profile Dave Jackson
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Message 65728 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 7:47:51 UTC - in response to Message 65726.  

All batches are being processed, are there any new work developments on the horizon?


Nothing on testing at the moment.

Just to clarify, almost everyone here probably installed BOINC using a package manager.
Yes, I think I don't know anyone else apart from Richard who has compiled from source. Not even sure if Richard has done it on Linux but I know he has with the Windows version.
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Richard Haselgrove

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Message 65729 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 8:57:24 UTC - in response to Message 65728.  

Yes, I think I don't know anyone else apart from Richard who has compiled from source. Not even sure if Richard has done it on Linux but I know he has with the Windows version.
Yes, I have compiled the client under Linux Mint - just experimentally, when I wanted to test a specific change. I started from Building BOINC on Unix - but make sure you follow all the side-tracks, particularly those relating to prerequisites, before you set out down that trail. Those pages aren't updated very often, so you may have to be ready to adjust e.g. package versions.

I found compiling the Manager was much harder, and without a pressing need, I gave up before I made it work. The biggest problem was the graphical design elements, which are supplied by a package called 'wxWidgets'. This comes in multiple versions, and upgrades aren't mutually compatible - you have to pick the right sub-version to match your particular vintage of the BOINC source code.

I've had much more consistent success with compiling under Windows. That uses Microsoft's 'Visual Studio' system, and the free 'community editions' are perfectly adequate for personal use. They are huge resource hogs, though.

A small group of BOINC volunteer programmers have been putting a lot of effort recently into setting up automatic continuous integration testing - the sort of thing which can pick up typos and syntax errors in new code, leaving the human programmers free to concentrate on getting the design and logic right. Those automatic test builds (for both Linux and Windows, possibly others) can be downloaded and run if you can find them: but the testing system is fluid, and the route-map for finding the resultant executable programs keeps changing, so I can't provide guaranteed advice.
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Profile Dave Jackson
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Message 65730 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 11:53:09 UTC

but make sure you follow all the side-tracks, particularly those relating to prerequisites, before you set out down that trail. Those pages aren't updated very often, so you may have to be ready to adjust e.g. package versions.


Yes much fun there ;) Though to be honest, I don't often get problems these days when I compile a new build either from release or testing branch.
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Jim1348

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Message 65731 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 15:07:33 UTC - in response to Message 65722.  

Another possibility, is that you're running Linux in a VM on a Windows machine.

I've found it best not to make life too complicated for a computer running climate models.

That is certainly my experience. I lose a lot more CPDN work units running Ubuntu 20.04.4 under WSL/Win10 than I do on a native Ubuntu 20.04 machine.
And there is nothing wrong with BOINC 7.16.6 for CPDN, or the later ones either (7.18.1, 7.20.2) that I have found.
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wateroakley

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Message 65732 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 16:01:52 UTC - in response to Message 65731.  
Last modified: 1 Aug 2022, 16:05:14 UTC

Another possibility, is that you're running Linux in a VM on a Windows machine.

I've found it best not to make life too complicated for a computer running climate models.

That is certainly my experience. I lose a lot more CPDN work units running Ubuntu 20.04.4 under WSL/Win10 than I do on a native Ubuntu 20.04 machine.
And there is nothing wrong with BOINC 7.16.6 for CPDN, or the later ones either (7.18.1, 7.20.2) that I have found.
Layered software, such as VMs, does make for a more complicated life. With an ubuntu VM on VBox/Win10, the finger of blame points towards the automatic monthly Windows updates for the majority of our model crashes. From 88 cpdn models, 71 have completed, 14 have crashed during an unannounced Windoze update, 3 crashed during a hard reboot to recover an unresponsive Windoze. We now pause Windoze updates for as long as possible and once a month ungraciously close the ubuntu VM to do all software updates in one go. This seems to have improved the success rate.
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AndreyOR

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Message 65733 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 18:33:33 UTC

As for VMs for CPDN, I agree with wateroakley, the majority of complications come from Windows restarts. I've done all of my CPDN work in VMs: WSL2 Ubuntu 20.04 on Windows 10 AMD and VBox macOS Mojave on Windows 10 Intel. By and large, almost all of my crashes have been non-VM related. Many happened early on before I learned how sensitive CPDN tasks can be to any kind of interruptions. I think the biggest complication with CPDN are the tasks themselves. Partly perhaps because they're still 32-bit but a lot of it is because they're complicated and very lengthy calculations that don't seem to be easily checkpointed and restarted. Other projects that don't do well with restarts are LHC@home ATLAS and Theory tasks. On a whole, I would not hesitate to recommend WSL2 for BOINC to anyone, WSL2 specifically because it uses very little resources compared to traditional VMs.
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KAMasud

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Message 65734 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 19:08:13 UTC - in response to Message 65721.  

I am still not willing to commit a wholesale massacre of WUs in order to change versions. Also, I am new to the World of Linux. Somebody, whoever it is should keep the updated version of Boinc.


I don't think I have ever had tasks crash as a result of changing versions, as far as I can tell they are no more likely to crash after a BOINC version change than any other instance of stopping and restarting the client.


I am not well versed with Linux. I know changing versions does not crash WU's. I just do not know how to go about it in Linux and it will be a massacre. I can however follow instructions. There might be others out there also following instructions. If someone can put up an instructions page, we will be happy to follow.
Yes, I do know my RAM is a bit low but to increase it, you have to shut down Boinc (I am running VMs). Shutting down Boinc, these WU's hate with a passion. However, I have noticed if I do " save the machine state" and then exit, these WU's are quite happy (also, they do not revert to the last checkpoint) but "save the machine state" does not allow a person to increase the RAM. You have to shut down Boinc to do it. It is something like catching a tiger by its tail.
The Version of Boinc is not the culprit. It is shutting down these WU"s and restarting. Now that I know this, I will just keep running these machines until they drop dead or complete the task's given/issued.
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KAMasud

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Message 65735 - Posted: 1 Aug 2022, 19:14:16 UTC - in response to Message 65732.  

Another possibility, is that you're running Linux in a VM on a Windows machine.

I've found it best not to make life too complicated for a computer running climate models.

That is certainly my experience. I lose a lot more CPDN work units running Ubuntu 20.04.4 under WSL/Win10 than I do on a native Ubuntu 20.04 machine.
And there is nothing wrong with BOINC 7.16.6 for CPDN, or the later ones either (7.18.1, 7.20.2) that I have found.
Layered software, such as VMs, does make for a more complicated life. With an ubuntu VM on VBox/Win10, the finger of blame points towards the automatic monthly Windows updates for the majority of our model crashes. From 88 cpdn models, 71 have completed, 14 have crashed during an unannounced Windoze update, 3 crashed during a hard reboot to recover an unresponsive Windoze. We now pause Windoze updates for as long as possible and once a month ungraciously close the ubuntu VM to do all software updates in one go. This seems to have improved the success rate.


I have paused all Windows updates for five weeks.
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Profile Dave Jackson
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Message 65736 - Posted: 2 Aug 2022, 10:53:00 UTC

All batches are being processed, are there any new work developments on the horizon?
Another 63 HADCM3S tasks on the testing server at the moment. Pretty sure all that testing will lead to main site work at some point but no hints in discussions in other places about how long this will take or what they need to know before sending them out.
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Message 65737 - Posted: 2 Aug 2022, 23:32:41 UTC

Just spied this change on the server site

OpenIFS 43r3
OpenIFS 43r3 ARM

Perhaps something in the wings?

I have not done any OpenIFS work units before so would like to try some.

OpenIFS did not have the 43r3 after its name yesterday.

Conan
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Les Bayliss
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Message 65738 - Posted: 3 Aug 2022, 4:01:12 UTC - in response to Message 65737.  

Andy has been upgrading the main site, to be the same as the dev site.
Those 2 apps have been around for a while now.

Make sure that you have LOTS of ram before trying any!!!
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Profile Dave Jackson
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Message 65739 - Posted: 3 Aug 2022, 6:41:22 UTC - in response to Message 65738.  

Andy has been upgrading the main site, to be the same as the dev site.
Those 2 apps have been around for a while now.

Make sure that you have LOTS of ram before trying any!!!

the ARM tasks are a proof of concept test that Andy has been running under emulation. I have looked up the arm emulation software and am still working on trying to get it to run. (Currently at the stage of getting the right libraries installed.) The other ones, Mac and Linux only are still to make it out of testing. I am hoping they will take over from the various hadam type tasks as being 64 bit they will not get trashed by those missing the 32bit libraries. (As Les says they need lots of RAM. Wouldn't download on my old machine. I would suggest a minimum of 64GB for running 8 cores.)
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